Wagner the NAR and new wineskins

The organisation which wants to be the 5th House in Christianity is convinced the world does not need the old systems or denominations any more.

C.P. Wagner, author of more than 70 books, taught at Fuller Theological Seminary for 30 years, holding graduate degrees in theology, missiology and religion from Fuller, Princeton Theological Seminary and the University of Southern California.

He calls his church-group “God’s prominent new wineskins”. He claims that God is no longer using Christianity but the NAR to change the world.

“From what we have been saying, it is obvious that one of God’s prominent new wineskins for this season is the NAR. The corresponding old wineskin is traditional denominational Christianity. Most Microsoft apostles maintain high respect for the old wineskin, partly because—at least in North America—that is where they had their Christian beginnings. God exhibits His mercy by not pouring new wine into the old wineskins because He doesn’t want them to break. After all, at one point in time, they were His new wineskins!”

(© Istockphoto Rich Vintage)

C. Peter Wagner writes,

Where Are the Apostles and Prophets?

Church-growth specialist C. Peter Wagner evaluates where the apostolic/prophetic movement has been—and where it’s going.

Most Christians know the Bible teaches that the church is

“built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief cornerstone” (Eph. 2:20).

However, many have fallen into the erroneous supposition that after the early church was established, the office of apostle and the office of prophet were no longer needed.

It is true that the annals of church history over the past 1,800 years or so have had little to say about apostles and prophets. Why? The biblical government of the church largely had been laid aside in favor of a more bureaucratic, administrative and legal structure both among Catholics and Protestants.

In recent times, however, apostles and prophets have been resurfacing. They once again are taking their rightful place of leadership among churches that are on the cutting edge of the current exponential growth of Christianity in many parts of the world.

The best I can personally calculate, the Second Apostolic Age began in 2001.

Before I explain how this developed, I should direct a word toward those who might doubt that apostles are ministering as such in today’s church. Paul writes that when Jesus ascended into heaven, He “gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers” (Eph. 4:11) in order to build up the body of Christ (v. 12).

The question is, how long were they to be around? The answer follows in verse 13:

“Till we all come to the unity of the faith … a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ.”

Obviously, we haven’t reached that goal yet, so apostles, prophets and all the rest are still needed—and will be for a long time.

How, then, did we lead up to 2001?

In the early 1900s, not only did we see the beginning of the Pentecostal movement, but we also saw the first component of what I like to call the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR) fall into place. That was the emergence of the African Independent Churches that had split from the previous generation of churches established by western missionaries. Since then, the independent churches have far surpassed mission churches in their dramatic growth.

The second NAR component was the Chinese house church movement that began in 1976. They experienced the greatest harvest of souls in a single nation in history.

Due to the change in religious policy after the end of the Cultural Revolution in the early-1980s “underground churches” could come more into the open. The state wanting to have control got in agreement with the protestant evangelicals to have an umbrella organization for all Protestant churches in the People’s Republic of China with Bishop K. H. Ting as its president: the China Christian Council (CCC). Together with the Three-Self Patriotic Movement, the organizations are known as the lianghui (两会), or “two organizations.” The CCC serves to unite and provide services for churches in China by formulating Church Order, encouraging theological education through seminaries and Bible schools, such as Nanjing Union Theological Seminary, publishing Bibles and other Christian materials, and coordinating training programs for churches.

In the 1970s, the Latin-American grass-roots churches began multiplying like mushrooms throughout Central and South America. Add the independent charismatic churches that became the fastest-growing segment of Christianity in America, and you have the main ingredients of the NAR.

In the East the Chinese and in the South (Latin Americans) having people who love special and intriguing things the evangelist missionaries could intrigue them and got lots of attention because of their mysterious actions of speaking in tongues and laying hands. Also with their song and dance activity in a church service they could please a lot of curious people.

A Generation of Apostles in North America

Focusing on North America, I believe that God desired to bring back apostolic government to the church in the years following World War II. During the late 1940s and through the 1950s, some notable new movements emerged under leaders whose names became household words, especially within the charismatic stream. Though some accepted the title “apostle” and others did not, they all led their movements apostolically.

It could be considered a time were several youngsters questioned the attitude of human beings and the position of God in our world. The Korean War and Vietnam War, the position of America and the Western capitalist countries their actions got many protesting against that violence but also questioning the churches involved. Looking for peace in the world people looked for a liberation and a church where they could feel liberated from the chains the Roman Catholic Church had brought unto them in the previous years or turmoil.  Decolonization of former European Colonial empires brought also a taste of freeing themselves from the religious system of the previous ‘occupiers’. In their search for some good feeling in the time of widespread corruption and several clan wars, diseases, and famine evangelicals and Pentecostals seemed to bring them some moments of escape. Those missionaries promised them a heaven on earth.

These were our pioneers. Some of the initiatives were known as restoration, Latter Rain, shepherding, discipling or the like. They enjoyed considerable growth momentum, but it wasn’t sustained. They made some mistakes, but all pioneers do.

Why did many of these movements led by World War II apostles fade? Some critics have made long lists of alleged mistakes, which I do not want to dwell upon. We must keep in mind that these pioneers had no textbooks on apostolic ministry, there were no role models to emulate, and associations allowing peer-level apostles to connect and interact were not yet contemplated. However, I would like to suggest that one of the most serious shortcomings of World War II apostles was their failure to align properly with intercessors and prophets. Let me explain how this defect was corrected over subsequent years.

Once it became clear that these fledgling apostolic movements were not going to increase in size and influence in North America, I believe that God began to implement a new process designed to resurface the biblical government of the church. The 1970s witnessed the emergence of the great prayer movements, many of which continue today.

As a part of this shift, the gift and office of intercessor began to be recognized by the body of Christ. Following that, the gift and office of prophet began to be highlighted in the 1980s. We’ve always had prophets in the church, but for the most part they weren’t recognized and accepted as such. Throughout the 1990s, the gift and office of apostle became activated more and more among cutting-edge church leaders.

God’s Timing and Microsoft Apostles

This historical sequence is interesting. Why would God first activate intercessors, then prophets, then apostles? The principal job description of intercessors is to open the pathway between heaven and earth in the invisible realm. Once they do this, the voice of God becomes more audible.

While all believers should hear the voice of God, those most called to tune in on the higher levels are the prophets. Prophets can be better prophets if they follow the intercessors. The prophets accurately receive and communicate the words from the Lord, but most of them have little or no idea as to what to do with the words they hear. It is the apostles who are assigned to take what the Spirit is saying to the churches and implement it by developing a strategy for moving forward.

After World War II the world became more and more connected with the different countries and cultures. Multiculturalism and alternative media made youngsters looking for the fusing of all sorts of music genres and cultural differences. In the traditional churches the contemporary beat music and all those electronic music instruments where considered from the devil. Though after the Beatles came movements such as grunge, the rave scene and hip hop spreading around the world to young people during the 90ies, aided by then-new technology such as cable television and the computer becoming a tool for the general public, bringing the World Wide Web.

Let’s call those apostles who began to emerge in the 1990s “Microsoft apostles.” As we go on, we’ll see many significant differences between them and the World War II apostles of a previous generation. One of them is that Microsoft apostles understand much better why they need to be aligned with prophets and intercessors.

Before taking a look at some of the more salient characteristics of the New Apostolic Reformation, it would be helpful to be aware of the worldwide scope of the movement. For the big Christian picture, I call on David Barrett, editor of the World Christian Encyclopedia and arguably the all-time most thorough statistical researcher of Christianity.

The reference work published by Oxford University Press has been described as serving as “an informational undergirding for Christian missionary work”.

Barrett divides world Christianity into six “megablocks,” equally proportioned between one Catholic megablock and five non-Catholic megablocks. Of the five non-Catholic megablocks, the NAR is the largest. Barrett’s terminology for this megablock is “Independent/Postdenominational/Neo-Apostolic.” It is the only one of all six megablocks growing faster than the world population and faster than Islam.

Among other things, this means that we are not dealing with a splinter group or some inconsequential cult. The NAR, in fact, is the 21st century’s mainstream Christianity. We may not notice it so much in North America, where the church in general has been experiencing decline in recent years. But it has become the most vibrant and explosive Christian movement throughout what Philip Jenkins calls the “Global South” (sub-Saharan Africa, Latin America and large parts of Asia, including India and China).

Starting when Jesus said,

“I will build My church” (Matt. 16:18),

His church has been growing for nearly 2,000 years. During that time it has grown in many different ways. Each time God changes the direction of the church, He provides a new wineskin. Jesus used this terminology when He was interacting with the disciples of John the Baptist. At that time, the change was from the Old Covenant to the New Covenant.

John the Baptist was the last prominent representative of the old wineskin, and Jesus was the first of the new wineskin. Jesus said,

“No one puts new wine into old wineskins. For the old skins would burst from the pressure, spilling the wine and ruining the skins. New wine is stored in new wineskins so that both are preserved” (Matt. 9:17, NLT).

God has new wine for the church, but only that segment of the church that adopts His new wineskin will receive it.

Today’s New Wineskin

From what we have been saying, it is obvious that one of God’s prominent new wineskins for this season is the NAR. The corresponding old wineskin is traditional denominational Christianity. Most Microsoft apostles maintain high respect for the old wineskin, partly because — at least in North America — that is where they had their Christian beginnings. God exhibits His mercy by not pouring new wine into the old wineskins because He doesn’t want them to break. After all, at one point in time, they were His new wineskins! He loves them, and so should we.

In the sweep of history, the New Apostolic Reformation represents the most radical change in the way of doing church since the Protestant Reformation. This statement does not mean to imply a change in doctrine. The doctrinal foundations of the Reformation such as the authority of Scripture, justification by faith and the priesthood of all believers remain intact. However, fundamental changes in the way the church has been organized and has operated for the better part of 500 years are being implemented.

Unless I’m mistaken, the most radical of all the changes from the old wineskin to the new wineskin is this:

the amount of spiritual authority delegated by the Holy Spirit to individuals. The two operative words are authority and individuals.

The old wineskin final authority in the Protestant churches never was entrusted to an individual, but always to a group. The final spiritual authority became a church council, a deacon board, a presbytery, church elders, a congregation, a synod, a general council, a state convention, a vestry, a national assembly, a session or any number of other ecclesiastical terms, all signifying a group but never individuals.

On the local church level, the new wineskin pastor is the leader of the church, not an employee of the church as he or she was in the old wineskin. If the church elders, for example, could hire a pastor, they could also fire a pastor. To keep the job, a pastor had to please the church. That partially explains why in America’s two largest denominations, the Southern Baptists and the United Methodists, pastoral tenure averages only two to four years. In apostolic churches, pastoral tenure is much longer—frequently for life—because the pastor does not report to the elders; rather the elders are appointed by and report to the pastor.

So to whom does the pastor report? He reports to the apostle. Typically, apostles form a network of churches and oversee their pastors. Apostolic networks are the functional successors to denominations. The major difference, however, is that networks led by Microsoft apostles are relationally based, not legally based. Those who follow apostles are voluntary—they can leave the network any time they desire. But they usually stay because they are grateful, convinced that the apostle adds value to their life and ministry.

If pastors report to the apostle, to whom does the apostle report? Many World War II apostles didn’t have a good answer to that question. However, Microsoft apostles typically have one or more other apostles with whom they have chosen to be aligned. For example, I lead a closed group of 25 apostles who are voluntarily aligned with me and who contribute toward my salary and benefits. I call it Eagles Vision Apostolic Team, and it is relational, not legal.

What About Prophets?

I’m aware that I’ve stressed the function of apostles more than that of prophets here. One reason is that apostles are first. Paul writes,

“And God has appointed these in the church: first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, after that …” a list of various spiritual gifts (1 Cor. 12:28, NKJV).

The use of numbers here is not to prescribe a hierarchy, but a divine order. If we take this literally, apostles cannot function properly without prophets. Every time I speak of the authority of apostles, I imply (even if I don’t verbalize it) apostles properly related to prophets. I already said that one of the weaknesses of World War II apostles was the failure to align with prophets. We need to do our best not to allow Microsoft apostles to make the same mistake.

Yes, both apostles and prophets are resurfacing. With the biblical government in place again, the church is poised for the greatest advance of God’s kingdom ever.

Source: C. Peter. Wagner, Where Are the Apostles and Prophets?, Charisma Magazine, Published 26/06/2014.
Additional text in-between by us


Preceding articles

Place for a fifth and sixth house in Christendom

History of the NAR cult infiltrating the marketplace

What is the Full Gospel Business Men’s Fellowship International (FGBMFI)?

C. Peter Wagner – The Don Quixote of Evangelicalism (Part 1): Knighted as a General

Using Alexander Dowie’s “altar call” system to suggest that they are God’s instrument to furthering the Kingdom of God here on earth

What is the Shepherding/Discipleship Movement (SDM)?

What Doctrines came out of the Shepherding/Discipleship Movement (SDM)?


Further reading

  1. A Reformation 500 Treat
  2. Thoughts on the Protestant Reformation 
  3. Reformation and Renewal
  4. Sola Scriptura, Holy Tradition, and the Hermeneutics of Christ
  5. Exposing The New Apostolic Reformation Part I
  6. Apostolic Succession and the Arian Controversy
  7. What is a Christian?
  8. Have We Forgotten the Point of Christianity?
  9. Musings on mere Christianity and ‘A Reforming Catholic Confession’
  10. Was the Reformers’ Gospel something new?
  11. Reclaiming and Re-Forming Baptist Identity
  12. To Make Room For New Things Get Rid Of The Old
  13. Beyond a Wine Patch
  14. Old and new wineskin
  15. Something new
  16. New Mind, New Wine
  17. Bridegrooms, unshrunk cloth, and new wineskins
  18. 2:22–New wineskins
  19. New Wineskins
  20. New Wineskins (by Welderbeth)
  21. New vintage
  22. New Wine and New Wineskins, and Old Wine and Old Wineskins
  23. New Clothes, New Wineskins, New Wine
  24. It’s About New Wineskins, Not Old Foreskins
  25. the need for new wineskins
  26. Defining new wine and embracing adulthood
  27. Politician proposes Genesis and Christ’s teaching for New Era economic model
  28. Modern Church: The End Is Near
  29. God’s Answer For Church Splits
  30. Coming of Age: My Look into Cults and Spiritual Practices Part 2
  31. Quick Devotional from 1 Corinthians 15:14 (Observation from the Greek)
  32. Discerning The False Vision of the ‘New Apostolic Reformation’ and their ‘Seven Mountains Mandate’.
  33. What are the Four Marks of the Church?
  34. If NAR is an organisation, who is its new leader?
  35. Who is Rodney Howard-Browne? Meet the Holy Ghost Bartender.
  36. The BBC reports on the New Apostolic Reformation
  37. Naked Bible Podcast Episode 180: Continuing the NAR Discussion with Dr. Michael L. Brown — Dr. Michael Heiser
  38. Religious News Association Panel: James Goll, Holly Pivec and Paula White talk on NAR.
  39. The BBC reports on the New Apostolic Reformation — Spirit Of Error
  40. Prophet James Goll’s ‘revealing’ interpretation of Luke 7:44 — Spirit Of Error
  41. Christianity Spread to Africa & Asia
  42. Religion Globalization in Botswana
  43. Review of Vinson Synan’s “The Holiness-Pentecostal Tradition” – John Boruff
  44. The Changing Face of Evangelicalism (ASCH 2017 Roundtable)
  45. The Church Needs Theological Checks and Balances
  46. The End of Consumer Christianity (Part II)
  47. Clear, Not Cryptic: How God Prepares You for the End Times
  48. Thirteen things I learned from my childhood church

2 thoughts on “Wagner the NAR and new wineskins

  1. Pingback: A new bible translationfrom the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR) group | Bijbelvorser = Bible Researcher

  2. Pingback: Brian Simmons and The Passion Translation Deception | Bijbelvorser = Bible Researcher

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